Jesse Michels, UAPGerb & Chris Ramsay - Flying Saucer Diner

Summary

Magician and UFO podcaster Chris Ramsay sits down at a flying saucer-themed diner with Jesse Michels and legacy-program researcher UAPGerb to compare notes on the people who may hold the deepest UFO secrets. Ramsay opens by showing how magicians use card forces and planted information to read people's tells, and argues that intelligence insiders use the same playbook in interviews. The talk then runs through dream guests, alleged Air Force program cover offices, Vatican UFO knowledge, and a claim that a monk with a vow of silence was flown to S4 to communicate telepathically with a non-human being.

Key takeaways

• 1Ramsay says he performs magic tricks on guests before recording to learn their nonverbal tells, comparing intelligence officials' evasions to card forces.
• 2Jesse Michels claims the late Paul Malmgren was likely CIA, citing his friendship with former CIA general counsel Tom Farmer and his use of the Institute for Defense Analyses as cover, and says Malmgren cited a foreign intelligence source documenting Townsend Brown collaborating with Tesla on gravity research.
• 3UAPGerb says forensic artist Bill McDonald's 1992 'Tehachapi Triangle' (XF-131 Super Sentinel) was based on a meeting with two Lockheed and two Northrop engineers at a Denny's in Antelope Valley.
• 4UAPGerb alleges that under former Air Force Under Secretary Edward 'Pete' Aldridge, 'outside activities' placed under SAF/AA bypassed normal special access program oversight, and links Russell Weiler or William McCorkle to the 'gatekeeper' Chris Mellon described in 2024.
• 5Jesse cites Eric Davis saying crash retrieval programs used materials scientists but no physicists, and links Jim Simons, Renaissance Technologies, Stony Brook, and David Spergel (head of NASA's 2022 UAP panel).
• 6Ramsay relays John Stewart's claim that remote viewers led intelligence agencies to a Carthusian monastery, from which two telepathic monks were allegedly flown to S4. Joe McMoneagle reportedly recalled a monastery tasking tied to hauntings.
• 7Jesse discusses his upcoming documentary on the alleged 1933 Magenta, Italy UFO crash, Pope Pius XII, Marconi's role in the 'RS/33' cabinet, and a yearly UFO research group said to meet at the Vatican.
• 8UAPGerb accuses Steven Greer of releasing witness testimony given under doctor-patient confidentiality and of editing James Fox out of interviews.

Glossary terms

Source

Transcript excerpt

We are completely misdirected. Yeah. Even when you're holding onto something as solid as a deck of cards. Cuz you talked about how just fallible memory is and and to this day I've been trying to think about how you did that and I just have no idea. I I I've no idea where I was tricked or where I'm not remembering or where that happened. I just I have no idea. I seen him do the thing with the glass where the glass just moves out. It's probably the simplest thing but I love it or the straw floats out and the straw's floating. I mean I'd never seen a magic show before. Yeah. I I really hadn't even seen card tricks. Yeah, and a lot of people have. They've seen videos of it but seeing in person is is way different cuz you're always you're one step removed on video so it's like watching a stage show, right? And you go, "Oh, there's smoke and mirrors. There's trapdoors, right?" But then when you it's in front of you, you all those variables seem to disappear and you're just left with nothing to Yeah, close-up is crazy. You you have the frustrating um thing happen to you where your suspension of disbelief is unwilling. Yeah. It's not willing. You're not like, "Oh, I'll suspend it for the sake of the trick." You're like, "No, I've exhausted my resources. I don't know how you did that." Yeah, on the videos you can stop it, go back frames, try to investigate. see how I did that on video. That particular one. So there's certain tricks that like you have to cut around or certain tricks that you have to like do. ...

Excerpt from AREA52 Podcast (Chris Ramsay), Jul 17, 2026. Rights remain with the original creators. Hear the full episode at the source.