S1 Ep50: The Prisoner of Charleston (Dead Letter Office)

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Because we see all of you. Learn more at trinityhealthofne.org slash cancer. Astonishing Legends Network. The views and opinions expressed by hosts and listeners on the Astonishing Dead Letter office are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of Astonishing Legends Productions, the Astonishing Legends Network, or any affiliated entities or guests. When something unexplainable happens to you, it can make you feel isolated or alone. But trust us, you're not. For over a decade, you've been sending your strange stories to Astonishing Legends. And now it's time for our fellow legenders to hear them, too. Join us weekly in Blanket Fortiana as we dig through your intriguing messages to the Astonishing Dead Letter office. Tonight's episode, The Prisoner of Charleston. So tonight's dead letter comes to us from a very good friend of ours who we've known for several years now. Yes. And it's someone we both know who has a sixth sense, you could say, a slight ability to pick up on things that are unseen and also feelings and impressions for as long as we've known them. And they, I think, felt very comfortable sharing that with us because, you know, we're nonjudgmental and we do believe these things are possible. And so they've told us interesting things, not only about ourselves, but people we know. And sometimes it's through touch. Sometimes it's a visual impression. And I've asked this person who we're going to call Veronica. What's that like? How do these images come to you? And I've asked that to many psychics and mediums who have these kind of impressions. I'm very curious about how that information gets relayed. And a lot of times what you'll find is that it's in different forms or different pathways or different ways that they perceive things. Sometimes it's played out like a movie in their mind's eye or they actually see it, something in front of them. And so Veronica here was able to describe that a little bit further, although, you know, they've told me a few times how that works for them. Sometimes I believe it's like an image projected in their mind's eye out in front of them. And sometimes, you know, it could be a dream. It could be some other form of basically sensation. Or sometimes it's a flood of empathic feeling about somebody or some event. And that's fascinating is that you just, they feel this emotion that comes with the person or the event or something in the past. So what we're about to hear is a very intense episode of that. So why don't you tell us a little bit more about the story here, Scott? What's interesting here about the story is that I think a lot of people have, they've taken tours. They've gone ghost tours. They've gone to places and maybe encountered something or think they encountered something. And that's what happened to Veronica. She took a tour of an old jail in Charleston, South Carolina, which is a frightfully haunted and amazing city that I have been to several times. It's a very cool place. They say it's one of the most haunted cities in America. Yeah, it's up there. That and Savannah, Georgia, those two are like two peas in a pod. So I would say, yeah, there's a lot of history there in that city, a lot of, you know, establishment of law in the early days. There was criminal activity. It's on the coast. There's all the stuff that goes with that. It's a whole nother level of debauchery when you get down near the coast in the early days of the United States. So it's a very cool place to say the least. But for our friend Veronica, who, as Forrest said, has a kind of gift, she encountered something there that she felt very specific about and was able to describe and try and figure out. And the other thing I would say about the way that she tells the story and the way somebody is that's been born this way and lived with it their whole lives, they have to come up with language and words that befit the feelings that they have and what their experience is like. And you're going to hear some of that as she relays the story. So, Forrest, I think you should read this one tonight. First off, I want to thank Scott and Forrest for the most incredible podcast and for creating the Dead Letter Office, a space for people like me to share the stories that have haunted us, that changed us or stayed with us. I've had the pleasure of knowing both Scott and Forrest since 2020 now, and I'm so deeply grateful to call them friends and to support the amazing work they do. They are both truly beautiful souls. Even though they know me well, I've chosen to remain anonymous, unfortunately because of the field I work in. So, back in 2021, my mom and I took a trip to Charleston, South Carolina for a wedding. As we often do when we travel, we look for something spooky to do. Charleston, with its rich and haunted history, felt like the perfect place for that kind of adventure. Just to give some background, I've had what I call abilities since I was a child. I wouldn't go so far as to label myself a psychic by any means, but I'm highly sensitive. I pick up on the emotions of people, both the living and the dead. I see spirit, feel spirit, and experience visions on a daily basis. It's something I've lived with my whole life, and I'm always working to better understand and refine it. It's just a part of me now, and I embrace every moment of it with gratitude. While researching haunted spots in the area, we found an old jail that offered ghost tours. It sounded ideal. Just the right amount of creepy and full of historical significance, which I've always loved. From the moment we arrived at the jail, I felt it. An overwhelming sense of sadness and a heavy, lingering energy. I mean, what else would you expect? This kind of reaction isn't unusual for me, especially in places with a difficult past. So, as I always do in these situations, I took precautions. I visualized a shield of bright white light around me and called on my spirit guides, the great spirit, and the universe for protection. As we made our way through the tour, I suddenly became aware of a man standing in the corner of one of the rooms. He had passed, but I could see him clearly in my mind's eye. This is typically how I perceive spirit. To explain that a bit more, imagine you're looking at an object or person right in front of you. Now close your eyes. You can still see it, right? That's how I see spirit, vividly and unmistakably, but with my inner vision rather than my physical eyes. The man I saw was around six feet tall with dark, slightly weighty hair, sad, deeply set eyes, and a very distinct mustache. As soon as I saw him, I was overwhelmed by a wave of dread. My chest tightened, and it suddenly became hard to breathe, like the feeling of having the wind knocked out of you. I did my best to block him out using my white light technique, but this spirit was unusually strong. At the time, I wasn't yet experienced enough to keep energy like that from breaking through. I did my best to stay grounded and get through the rest of the tour, but when I'm around a spirit that strong, I don't just sense their emotions, I actually absorb them. It's like their fear, happiness, sadness, or anger becomes my emotion. Or, on the flip side, the overwhelming sense of how they make others feel also affects me as I feel it in my chest, in my breathing, and other parts of my body, depending on the emotion. Their energy settles into me in a way that feels physical, not just emotionally overwhelming, but almost like I'm carrying the weight of their experience, or how others experience them, in my own body. After the tour ended, and we were back outside, I pulled one of the tour guides aside, a historian as well, and asked if there was a well-known male spirit connected to the jail. I described everything I had seen in as much detail as I could. The guide looked at me with wide eyes, visibly taken aback. He then pulled out his phone and showed me a picture of the man he thought I might be talking about from an old newspaper clipping. And to my complete shock, it was him. Exactly as I had seen him. I was only about 20 at the time, and it wasn't unusual for me to doubt myself after these kinds of experiences. It's easy to second-guess something so intangible, but this moment? It shifted something. It helped me begin to trust in what I was seeing and feeling. Unfortunately, because I didn't yet know how to fully shield myself, the man's energy clung to me. I don't recall exactly what he had been imprisoned for, but it was something violent, possibly murder, or something equally disturbing. His presence followed me all the way back to the hotel. My mom helped smudge me and used her own energy, visualized as a protective white light, to help clear whatever had attached itself to me. Together, we were able to push it out, but it remains one of the most terrifying and educational encounters I have ever had. I still can't quite put into words the sheer darkness of that man's energy. It was one of the heaviest things I've ever felt. Now, with more years and experience behind me, I've learned how to protect myself more effectively. I've grown stronger, more grounded, and that experience in Charleston played a big role in shaping the path I'm on now. I have many stories I could tell, some even involving experiences I've had with Scott and Forrest, but I chose this one because it was one of the most defining moments of my life. That night in Charleston never really left me. It's more than just a memory. It's a reminder of the unseen things that walk beside us. Some doors open without warning. Others we walk through willingly. Either way, what we find on the other side can change us forever. The Unexplained awaits. We'll return to the shadows momentarily. Astonishing Legends is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible. Financial geniuses. Monetary magicians. These are things that people say about drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds. Because Progressive offers discounts for paying in full, owning a home, and more. Plus, you can count on their great customer service to help you when you need it, so your dollar goes a long way. Visit Progressive.com to see if you can save on car insurance. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations. Now, back to the show. So that's a pretty interesting story to me. She's definitely crossing paths with something, or at least that's what it seems like. But before we go any further, we wanted to share a follow-up email that she sent a few weeks later, after she sent her dead letter in. Finally, I have an update for you. Now that I have some free time, I was able to find the guy. I couldn't get access to his picture on the newspaper clipping, because I think that site is down. But I was able to find a picture of him through the Facebook page for the tour, from a video tour, that a guy put up there a few years ago. Go to Timestamp 430, and we'll put a link to that. If you have a Facebook page, you'll be able to get to that. I was able to watch that. I could not get to the image link that she shared, but she did send another image later, which we have, and we'll post with this episode. His name is William Marcus. She said he was the first white man to be executed in Charleston County since the Civil War, and was hanged there for the murder of his allegedly bigamous wife, stabbing her around 47 times with an ice pick. She says, this is absolutely the guy, and 100% who I saw that night. Even seeing the picture again after all these years made me feel ill, but I'm glad I found it. Veronica. So here's what's interesting about that. I decided I was, you know, of course, I had all this other work I was supposed to be doing, and I decided I had to go down the William Marcus rabbit hole because it is how I procrastinate. That's by procrastinating on the current paranormal thing I'm supposed to be working on. I do that by working on another paranormal thing that I'm not supposed to be working on. See how that works? Well, that's how you get a lot of work done. That's how I do it. Yeah. You just have to make sure your distraction is something that you have to do. It just may be down the list a long ways. Yeah, that's right. You take the thing way down the list, and you move it to the top because the thing at the top is too overwhelming to start. So that's basically what I did. But I started looking for William Marcus, and we have all kinds of access to different platforms, which anybody can get to, by the way. I'm just talking about, like, Ancestry.com, Newspapers.com, Library of Congress searches for some of the public records. There's other places to look. But I started looking for William Marcus, and at first I couldn't find anything. Nothing was coming back. So I had to keep researching. And when I say researching, I don't mean researching. I mean R-E hyphen searching, where you're changing your search terms and trying to, like, just get anything to come up. Right, right. And I was like, if this guy stabbed somebody with an ice pick, it was going to be in the paper. It's going to be there, especially 42 times. And eventually I found a slew of newspaper articles. And what was interesting was Veronica actually sent one, too. And that one that she sent has a picture. And it's the picture that you'll see if you look at the notes for this episode. You know, the Dead Letter episodes don't have their own webpages. But maybe when we share this one on Patreon, I can make that part of it free for folks. Because they get the commercial-free early versions of the episodes there at AstonishingLegends.com slash Patreon. And the picture is scary. So what's interesting is I started to find all these additional details about the crime. And a couple of articles said that the victim was stabbed 14 times, but most of them did say 42. That's the kind of stuff we see all the time when we look up old newspaper articles. 14 and 42 sound very similar. It could just be a verbal misrepresentation. It's hard to know. Both are pretty heinous. One of the articles did indicate that he said, I think, it is trial. The reason he did that was because he didn't want her to suffer and wanted to be sure she was dead. Which, of course, is what a horrible person says to make excuses for horrific behavior. But maybe that was this guy's twisted logic. But the details are all over the place. But one of the things that did come out shortly before he was executed was that he had already been married. And that he had abandoned his wife and family in Ohio. They even had children. And he had come all the way down to Charleston, where he met this woman, the victim, and wound up killing her because she was having an affair. Now, at the time, she had been working for three or four months at some colonel's house or a general's house or something on Sullivan's Island, which is right off the coast of Charleston there. And he wanted her to quit working there. It didn't say in any of the articles who this affair was with or if it even really was an affair. Who knows what it, you know, maybe he's just making up reasons to justify bad behavior. I'm not saying that what he's saying is true. But he wanted her to quit working there. So maybe there's an implication that she was having an affair with the owner of that house or something. But it was the only job she had. She was trying to pay off her mortgage for her house on Sullivan's Island. And it turns out, though, that he couldn't have been legally married to her because he still was married to his wife back in Ohio and the kids there. So the murder was committed on April 13th or 14th of 1906. He was hanged at 11.05 a.m. in the jail yard of the jail that Veronica toured on August 3rd of 1906, the same year, but several months later, and pronounced dead nine minutes past 11.05. The church that the victim had gone to, his second wife, in quotes, that she attended a confession for just before he killed her, is still there on Sullivan's Island. It's called the Stella Maris Church, S-T-E-L-L-A-M-A-R-I-S church.org. If you go there, that's where she had made her confession. Shortly before, he took her for a walk down to the beach, ostensibly for a nice little getaway, where he used an ice pick that he sharpened, especially for the occasion, to kill her there on the beach. The other fact that we learned in one of the longer articles we found was that he converted to Catholicism, of course, now that he's stuck in jail and about to die, and he repented, and he seemed remorseful, and he apologized in court, and he apologized to all the people before he died. There was, I think, a priest that sponsored him and brought him a new suit to wear for his hanging. By all accounts, he was not wobbly at all when he went to the gallows, and during some of the interviews that he had with local journalists, the gallows were being constructed right outside of his cell, and they said he wasn't reacting to that at all. He had, I guess, a will drawn up, but then when they found out he had been married before, it had to be destroyed. He tried to give the house of the woman he killed to a local mission as a donation, but they later said, well, you can't do that because you weren't actually married to her, and you have no say over what happens with her. And there were other things that were built into his own possessions that would go back to his wife and family in Ohio. I did find all those people. I found profiles on Ancestry. This was 1906, so by the time you go that far back, these folks are in a lot of people's family trees because there's a lot of kids and propagation going on of the human race between 1906 and 2026. And so that guy's profile's in a lot of trees, and the kids had kids and all that kind of stuff. So it's just a wild case, but clearly a very, very dark, dark crime. And so one of the things that I had emailed Veronica about when I found these additional articles, and she knew some of these details already, but I just said to her, you know, I wonder what you encountered in the jail. Because he supposedly was repentant at the end, but maybe that was all a show, who knows. But he went to the gallows without protest and without fear, it seemed, according to all the witnesses. So maybe he was repentant and at peace with confession and the punishment that he deserved. So then in that case, this horrific, creepy thing that Veronica encountered for her from a psychic or an empathic standpoint while she was at the jail, what was that? And this is something we've talked about on Astonishing Legends over the years. You don't always know what you're interacting with. And if you listen to our series, The Siren Call of the Hungry Ghost or The Vertical Plane or anything where there's a lot of communication with something from the other side, it might be pretending to be that person you know and have all that data that makes you think that it's that person you know. Or maybe even in this case where it's somebody that Veronica didn't know at all, but the locals all are like, oh, no, that's William Marcus. He did this crime. But is it or is it something darker and more evil? Or is it a shadow of the evil that he committed that isn't even connected to who he was in life? I don't know. Well, as any ghost hunter knows, and even those who don't ghost hunt, you know that prisons are fertile hunting grounds for the ghosties because of such emotion. And, well, just the violence, really. And if you believe in any kind of stone tape theory or the ability for human energy and emotion to get imprinted into physical objects, it's a prison. There's a lot of stone there. Again, just the misery, the evil intentions, the dark thoughts, all that negativity mixed with hope and redemption and all that. It's a blend and people are literally stewing there in a small cell, just ruminating on this stuff, what they did with and feelings of resentment and revenge and what they're going to do when they get out or just repentance. And so it's a really concentrated place of human emotion for years on end or a short period of time before you're executed. And so, yeah, it's very fertile ground for ghost hunting. And so it's going to give off a vibe. And this place certainly did. And then you wonder, what do you think you're picking up on and this gentleman? So from what I remember her saying is that it's a little bit vague because you're never sure. You get this flood of feeling and it's crushing and it's kind of momentarily devastating and it lingers for a while. And you have to work to clear that out, but you definitely know when you see the picture, like that's the guy. And so there is that connection between from that moment all the way to the distant past at the turn of the century to a present day feeling that, you know, it's as if the guy was there in your bedroom standing over you and you wake up. That kind of horrible feeling. But in this case, when Veronica had submitted this story for us to possibly include in a DLO, she really couldn't remember the guy's name, I believe, or much of the detail about the crime. I remember her telling me about it. I said, and this is several years ago. So obviously it's going to fade over time. It's something you don't want to dwell on anyway. So you're trying to put it out of your mind and not, you know, continually carry that around, all those dark feelings from somebody else because it's, yeah, it's debilitating. It's crushing. It's just not good. Not good mojo. And so you're trying to get rid of that. I said, okay, well, I hate to press you on this, but I think it's important to the story if we do find out who this person is. So I did press her and was like, okay, I know you're very, very busy right now, but if you could get a hold of the ghosting tour and possibly talk to that tour guide, and I'm sure they know who this person is, other tour guides there, because, again, they all know the stories that make the tour a great experience for guests. I just want to point out, and this is something that adds a certain amount of credibility to Veronica's story, is that sometimes these ghost tours, and I'm not saying this one at all, I'm not casting aspersions on the one in Charleston at the jail. But they make characters up, and I know that because I've been on a tour where that happened, because I came home, of course, and looked it up and found out that a story that was told to me in North Carolina was, in fact, taken from a famous ghost story in New York City down at the ports. And that happens, and whatever. It's fine. It's folklore, maybe. For me, it's like, no, I want to know about the real ghost. I don't want the made-up thing that everyone's telling at every port city up and down the East Coast. But the thing about this guy is like, no, this dude is real. We got pictures. We got history. We got articles on what he did. That's the thing I like about this. And so I just wanted to – I'm sorry to interrupt you, but I just wanted people to understand there's a difference between that, and sometimes they're just like, oh, this is all one-eyed Sally that was behind the bar and had a wooden leg. It's like, no, this is a real dude, and this really happened. And this is one of my favorite things about our good friend Allison Jornlin and her brother's company, American Ghost Walks. They have ghost tours all over the country. Always look for them. They do deep research, and the stories you hear are based on real research that Allison does herself, and that's one of the reasons that I love going on the tours with her company. You know, it's entertainment. You go on these ghost hunts. It's like, yeah, that guy died. He fell off the building. It's like, okay, you see his ghost? No, not really. He just died here. That's it. Where's the juice in there? Give us some zhuzh. So, getting back to why this is relevant to the story here, folks, I want to say, yes, when you hear the letter being read, some of you will just say, oh, there's a lot of woo to this. And then I thought, hey, look, most of us here that are listening and are involved with this and within our circle of friends, there's a lot of woo to go around with all of us. So, even with myself and yourself, sir, woo does happen. You can't stuff the woo into a sack. I'll dive into my own woo. I don't claim to be psychic or paranormally gifted, but for whatever reason, I can tell when I'm in the presence of someone who genuinely is, and Veronica is one of those people. Okay. And I can just tell. I just know. Yeah. I just know when it's a real person or a fake person, and that's something I've only learned since we started our show. So, but I can tell you that there's no question in my mind that Veronica has a gift. There's definitely a good vibe, like a light and love kind of a vibe there. I'm personally not sure about everything that she's feeling and experiencing and seeing, and I don't think she is either. She'll just relay like, well, this is kind of what. No, I'm not saying that. I'm not talking about accuracy. I'm saying there's something more to this person. Yes, exactly. So, there's some kind of sense there, and she would not say definitively what's happening, but I find it interesting because I think she's accurately. She, as best she can, relaying what's coming across. And so, that also, that process is fascinating. As I said before, we started to read the story about how the images show up and what's happening there. And so, in this instance here, when we're talking about Wu, it's like, look, we're all here, and even if you're rolling your eyes real hard, they fall out of your head. You know somebody that something kind of crazy has happened to, or maybe has a little bit of intuition that's above normal, it seems. That's right. And maybe you've experienced something that's unexplainable. I think that interest alone is why a lot of us are here. Even our hardcore skeptic friends that are close to us, you know, you ask them, like, well, why are you even listening? It's like, well, you know, I don't believe in much of any of this, but it's fascinating. And it's like, you could take it at that. So, here, though, getting back to what's really going on, it's like, yeah, there is that aspect of being the conduit. And so, as I mentioned earlier here, there is some, what's known as psychometry or clairtangency. And so, that's the ability to pick up ESP information or emotions or images, sensations, could be smells, could be audible, through touch usually, or just being in the area or the presence, and you're kind of soaking that up. And so, it could be a transfer of some kind of history, some kind of psychic energy that the person who is the gateway to this experiences, or it kind of goes through them and is expressed. So, here you have this dynamo of all this psychic and ghostly spiritual energy here being ramped up, just being in a prison, and it's focused on one person. And so, now they're flooded, and this one person comes across. And so, as I was saying before, it's like, okay, so that's kind of the transfer here of this information from possibly this being, and you put up a good point here, how do you know it's that person? Because you have so many people that have come through there with ill intent, you know, like, who don't have your best interest at heart and would like to do you harm. And they all want to voice or exert influence on the living, especially folks like Veronica, in that they now have somebody they can access. And so, you have all this input coming in. But that's kind of why I said, I think we need to find out who this is. It closes the loop. It gives you a little bit of closure. It's an epilogue on this story. The hook, the button, the zing. At the end, it's like, okay, now we know who this is. You know, so I knew Scott would be all into trying to find out who this name is, but she did come up with this. Okay, this is the guy. And so now, even if you don't believe this, it was verification to Veronica herself in that, again, kind of unsolicited, if you believe her story, that she gets through the tour, she asked the person, and they knew who she was talking about. It's like, is this the guy on the phone? Yes, it is. And so, that's all you need to know. It's like, okay, this is not just some rando criminal. This was a real guy here, and this is what he did. He was hanged for it. But, like, is it really that person? Well, in a sense, it doesn't matter. But now you do have something historical that you can anchor to. It's a fascinating story. It's even more fascinating because it's somebody we know and trust and is a friend of ours. And so, like I said, you could be reading this in the travel log for South Carolina. It's like, okay, well, I don't know if I believe all that. But it is a real guy. You know what I'm saying? Because people write blogs all the time, and we have pulled information. You know, that's kind of the problem with covering a ghost story, like in our podcast, is that you come across a lot of great stories, like seeing Lafitte's eyes as a ghost in New Orleans, people seeing it in the fireplace, or I turned around, he was standing there in full pirate gear. That would be, folks, the pirate Lafitte, L-A-F-F-I-T-T-E, who we have also done a series on. So look for that if you want more about it. That's what I'm saying. It's like we came across a lot of great stories. But it's like, on the other hand, they're just stories in a blog. Like, they're really interesting, and they're creepy and scary. And I've been there a couple of times, didn't see anything. But definitely the place has a vibe, and I just love the history of it. But I sat near the fireplace, and I didn't feel anything, other than the buzz from the purple slushy machine. You're always like, I never see anything. I never feel anything. Meanwhile, like, weird things, or people are walking in front of you that shouldn't be there, and flowers are appearing, and you're just like, oh, it's nothing. Here's the difference, sir. And I have talked about this a little bit. I might see something, or I get a flash, like, in the corner of my eye, like, oh, there's an old-timey dude with a big handlebar mustache. And, oh, maybe he stabbed his wife. That's all on paper. I've never felt anything that whammied me like that, like it did Veronica. You know what I'm saying? I just think your bar, I think your bar's too high. No, I think you're looking in the wrong place. No, I'm telling you, look, I'm being honest here. It's like, I've seen some stuff. It's like, okay, that wasn't there a moment ago. That shouldn't have happened. The physics on that don't make sense. Or maybe I've seen something, but I've never felt it to my core. And, like I said, I've spoken with other folks about this, our close friends, who have experienced like this or have the ability to receive psychic impressions. I've gotten feelings, usually, if something that I think of happens later, the premonition stops at being like, oh, I just thought about that yesterday. And now it's happened. But it wasn't like it hit me like a thunderbolt, or I saw a vision in front of me. It doesn't do that to anybody. No, it does, though. This is what we're saying. I don't know what thunderbolt, I mean, yeah, maybe Veronica, but she's got more of a gift than most people. But I'm just saying, I think little things might be happening to you all the time, and you're not seen. No, Scott, my point is that little things happen to all of us all the time, and some people choose to ignore it. But it doesn't really make an impact on most of us because there isn't that feeling of like, wake up, here it is, take a look at this, pay attention, here's the message. And so I actively look for messages around me, and I try to pay attention. But what I'm saying is that, yes, with this gift, and it can be a little bit of a curse unless you learn to control it. And that's part of her message as well, is that if you're very sensitive to this, it can be so overwhelming and devastating and debilitating that it can be a very negative experience. See, I feel like, not to get into a paranormal therapy session here, and we should wrap this episode up, but I feel like you're thinking a little bit too much about how much the X-wing weighs. That's what I think. Oh, is that, I just saw Yoda try to lift one. Yeah, that's my little Yoda metaphor, because we just talked about him in another dead letter. No, here's the thing, I'm not looking for any answers or denying it or trying to validate any experiences. Like I said, I'm totally open to it. What I'm trying to describe to you is what I have honestly, objectively experienced. To me, I have not had this feeling. You had it more so yourself. You're, I think, a little more sensitive, like being in the basement at the Kent Theater. And that was one of the first times I was with you in person, sir. Yeah. Where we were in the basement, you looked a little green in the gills there, a little white, you know, white as a sheet, white as a ghost. And I said, are you okay? And he's like, yeah, it's just a little harder to breathe down here. And my first thought was like, yeah, it is very musty. It could be a mold reaction or dust reaction or allergic. And you're like, yeah, just I'm feeling my chest a little tight. And it's a little hard to breathe. I'm going to go upstairs. And so you walked upstairs. I stayed down while we were being shown more of the workshop where the theater techs would build stuff and repair stuff. It wasn't until later when I walked upstairs and you and I were talking and it was told to us where you were describing what you were feeling. And she said, well, that's interesting. You know, that's where the caretaker of the theater had a heart attack and died. Yeah. In his workshop down there. And it's like, okay, maybe that was just more than dust or mold. So what I'm telling you is I've never had anything that is even that closely intense. Although I'm not looking for that, obviously. But it's more objective, I guess, or on paper or you'll have a thought like maybe, oh, you know what? I wonder if somebody died here. I get the sense that or just an idea that somebody had died and you find out later like, oh, he did. But it's not like a psychic impression. Right. And so that's why Veronica's descriptions here are so interesting because they're so intense. And over time, she's learned to kind of control that. And so on that scale, if you're open to it and you seem like you're not going to make fun of people, if you ask them, more people will open up and say, yeah, you know, something weird happened and I felt it. And that's the difference. It's not like I just thought about this and it happened like myself. They felt it and then something happened or the feeling was so intense that it could not be ignored. So just to reiterate, I know that finding out who this person was, who she saw, won't make any difference to those who don't know Veronica or don't believe in that kind of ability or this kind of story. But I think for those of us who are open to the possibility, it does add some veracity that this was a person that she saw. But even that doesn't matter. I think it matters most of Veronica that it added some confirmation that what you experienced was real. Things are happening to all of us all around and it's whether you pay attention. And to some of us, the messages around us will go unnoticed if you don't pay attention. And even if you are, it's just very wispy. And to some of us, it hits us like a sledgehammer. Veronica, thank you so much for sending your story into the Dead Letter office. Can't wait to see you in person again before too long, hopefully. And if there's any updates on this story, please share them with us. Folks, if you have a story like Veronica's, maybe you encountered something unusual on a ghost tour that seemed to stand out to you more than the traditional stuff, please send us your story or any other ones that you think might sound good to us in Blanket Fortiana. You can email them to deadletteroffice at astonishinglegends.com. We'll see you next week. The Astonishing Dead Letter Office is hosted by Scott Philbrick and Forrest Burgess and is executive produced by Tess Feifel. The show is edited and mixed by Sarah Voorhees-Wendell at VW Sound. The theme is based on the Astonishing Legends theme by Judson Crane at Founder Music, arranged by Alan Carissia, who composes all the other music in the show. Tommy Beaver Design created the logo. The announcer is John Bolton. That's me. 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